On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up - Deadspin Comments

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

LoveHandles — Tue, 06 May 2008 14:43:08 EDT

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

ExpensiveShirt — Tue, 06 May 2008 12:12:40 EDT

There is plenty of merit to making satirical comments on race, and normally the more offensive (or surprising) the better.

For all the indefensible Cosmo Kramer like tirades, there's high brow cultural awareness lifting material from geniuses like Murphy, Pryor, Lenny Bruce, Chris Rock and Chappelle. Where would race discussions be without the likes of these guys?

ExpensiveShirt

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

JoeyPorterAle — Tue, 06 May 2008 11:11:22 EDT

@supermike5alive: Watch that Steelers suck stuff, I don't own and Intrepid, but I'm sure they can be rented.

JoeyPorterAle

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

O.D.B. McDowell — Tue, 06 May 2008 02:22:30 EDT

Haven't been around too much lately, but I gotta say this was a great post. A little self-examination from time to time does the Deadspin good.

And no I am not black, I just play one in my avatar.

O.D.B. McDowell

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

azz100 — Mon, 05 May 2008 23:37:58 EDT

I think maybe... Will, it's time to drop the "we". You've become a voice, perhaps not singular, but your- not "we's'-- opinion means something. I understand the coy reference, but man, it don't work-- especially when you're responding to something like this. We might not like it, but you're almost mainstream. It's time to stand behind it-- proudly.

azz100

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

The Fake Gimel Martinez — Mon, 05 May 2008 23:04:57 EDT

So, just so we're clear, its okay to laugh at Stuff White People Like if you're white, right?

The Fake Gimel Martinez

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

garbageday — Mon, 05 May 2008 22:15:35 EDT

@Your GPA: "Weir, Johnny: 'Flamboyant' figure skater whose 'flamboyant' (and amusing) nature constantly offends the non-'flamboyant' rulers of the figure skating world, who seem surprised that a male figure skater might be 'flamboyant.' Also, does it with guys."

Good call.

garbageday

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

IchiroSuzukiSamurai — Mon, 05 May 2008 20:25:47 EDT

I didn't compare it at the time to the Winslow coverage, but I always thought Roethlisberger got a free ride. At the time it happened, we didn't know who had done what, but riding a motorcycle without a helmet may be legal, but it's beyond dumb.

IchiroSuzukiSamurai

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

supermike5alive — Mon, 05 May 2008 19:57:02 EDT

@JoeyPorterAle: that's fine with me - i think Roethlisberger is retarded and the Steelers suck, so i'm with ya!

supermike5alive

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

EditorOfTheDailyFaberian — Mon, 05 May 2008 19:30:05 EDT

@redsoxchick: These people disagree:

[www.blackpeopleloveus.com]

EditorOfTheDailyFaberian

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

ceedat — Mon, 05 May 2008 18:42:13 EDT

@redsoxchick: It's not every white person is racist its white people may not be aware of how race shapes their perception of the world. The fact that you think its "bullshit" is shaped by your perception, but the fact that someone walks up to me and says yo, what's up homie, he may not think its racist but I can see how his perceptions of race affects that, Will may bust everyones balls but when he busts Gumbel's balls for "sounding white" then it may be driven by the perception that "Real" black people don't talk like Gumbel but instead talks like Mr. T but the question why is Mr. T blackness "realer" Gumbels that's where the stereotypes come in.

ceedat

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

redsoxchick — Mon, 05 May 2008 18:10:48 EDT

@ArmansCopyOfSwank: I'm sorry, I don't buy into the "every white person is racist even if they don't think they are" bullshit.

Will isn't afraid to rake anyone across the coals and now, suddenly, he has latent racist tendencies?

redsoxchick

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

ceedat — Mon, 05 May 2008 17:38:23 EDT

@IsoldmysoultoMilhouseVanhouten:Now that is the trouble with the internet for the most part I don't think that commenters on this site believe in the stereotypes that divide us, I don't think that y'all really think we all look like Martin Lawrence otherwise I wouldn't visit it but you can never really tell on the internet unless you're on Stormfront or something

ceedat

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

IsoldmysoultoMilhouseVanhouten — Mon, 05 May 2008 17:26:02 EDT

@ceedat:
@ceedat:

I'm not trying to say that what Chappellle did was racist. It was definitely much smarter than that. But I always assumed that most of the racial humor around here was in the same vein.

IsoldmysoultoMilhouseVanhouten

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

JoeyPorterAle — Mon, 05 May 2008 17:18:27 EDT

@supermike5alive: Ben was not permitted to ride without a helmet since he did not meet the criteria - either 2 years with a motorcycle license or having completed an approved motorcycle safety course. If I recall correctly, he was cited and paid the fine. He was partially at fault for the extent of his injuries for failure to obey the helmet law. Whereas, Winslow was totally responsible for his, and that's the difference from my perspective.

JoeyPorterAle

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

mcsey — Mon, 05 May 2008 17:16:18 EDT

Now damnit Leitch, if you don't stop writing things that are mature, intelligent, and reflective, I'm gonna have to find another sports blog to read.

Nice post, man.

mcsey

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

ceedat — Mon, 05 May 2008 17:16:07 EDT

@IsoldmysoultoMilhouseVanhouten:
So if Chappelle's whole shtick was "look at the stereotypes they're so true so you shouldn't be afraid to laugh" like Mencia's is then it would be a problem but instead its "look at how ridiculous these trivial/untrue stereotypes are lets laugh at the absurdity of it all" e.g. This Racism is killing me on the inside.

ceedat

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Racists_Inc. — Mon, 05 May 2008 17:11:34 EDT

@supermike5alive: Do you treat everyone the same? If you assume that people are equal without taking into account their merits or detriments, you are probably doing the world as much a disservice than if you treated them differently because of their race and not understanding their abilities.

Racists_Inc.

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

formerly Chief Wahoo — Mon, 05 May 2008 17:11:20 EDT

@IsoldmysoultoMilhouseVanhouten: See my earlier post. I believe it is different. When a race has an ongoing history of getting shit on then yes, they do deserve a little more leeway. I'm not trying to excuse misbehavior by black people but I think it behooves whiteys like me to cut minorities a little slack.

formerly Chief Wahoo

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

The Fake Gimel Martinez — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:57:43 EDT

@morrisalmondjoy: I think it would be interesting to see what the majority of Deadspin readers want. Those of us who comment I would dare say are not the majority of the site views.

The Fake Gimel Martinez

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

ceedat — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:57:31 EDT

@IsoldmysoultoMilhouseVanhouten:
The difference was he was lampooning the stereotypes by trying to show how they are either ridiculous or untrue i.e. the episode where Wayne Brady becomes a gangster, whereas some people here may believe that these stereotypes are true and are laughing at the people that they are being applied to which is why he quit his show, it's the difference between Chappelle and Mencia, Chappelle believed that the stereotypes were either untrue or trivial whereas many believe they are inherited genetic characteristics

ceedat

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

IsoldmysoultoMilhouseVanhouten — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:48:19 EDT

@ceedat:

What about when Chapelle plays a white guy in the wife swap sketch? Isn't that getting laughs by playing up the same black guy/white guy stereotypes we joke about here? Is it somehow different when he does it?

IsoldmysoultoMilhouseVanhouten

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

DwayneBoweCoalition — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:47:12 EDT

I'm looking forward to a panel on race and the internet that features Will Leitch, the guy who runs stilesproject.com and Brian Suksumwong.

DwayneBoweCoalition

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

supermike5alive — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:38:08 EDT

@Balls State Explorer: hey are you Whitlock?

@Jen P: what I read that person say was - if it's racist when a white person does "this thing", then it's also racist when a black person does "this same thing".

double standards are not good for anybody.

supermike5alive

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Jen P — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:35:08 EDT

@supermike5alive: No, I don't think that's correct. Treating people differently isn't necessarily racist; treating people badly because of their race is racist.

Jen P

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

ceedat — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:34:57 EDT

@new_commentator: See that comment has nothing to do with race but the comfort level that white people have with black people, Malcolm X makes whites uncomfortable nowhere in that quote does it say that Bryant Gumbel is white nowhere in those skits do they say Wayne Brady isn't black its a comment on the "safe negro" phenomenon not the he's not really black

Malcolm X = the scariest black to white america not the blackest black man

ceedat

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

supermike5alive — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:25:48 EDT

@new_commentator: correct

supermike5alive

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

formerly Chief Wahoo — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:23:53 EDT

@jabostick: I don't think the two are exactly the same, but anyone who gets on a motorcycle knows that they are going to be injured at some point. At least the ones with any common sense do.

formerly Chief Wahoo

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

morrisalmondjoy — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:21:20 EDT

@Lady Andrea: thanks for putting that image in my head.

morrisalmondjoy

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Kccal — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:19:52 EDT

What about people who aren't white or black? Would it just be miscellaneous then?

Kccal

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

morrisalmondjoy — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:18:48 EDT

@The Fake Gimel Martinez: Most of the time

morrisalmondjoy

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

The Coach is KILLING Me! — Mon, 05 May 2008 16:05:31 EDT

If you remember from the show, Whitlock totally disputed Kellen Winslow Sr. and his statements -- saying that he was remembering it completely wrong.

That being said, my cab driver who took me to the Charlotte airport last week told me how having a black man as President would be "a disaster," and proceeded to tell me what particular deficiencies of black people would cause the most trouble. Fortunately, we were almost there by the time he started this rant, so I tipped him $0 and got away as quick as I could. Not really an Internet story, but fresh in my mind when talking about race...

The Coach is KILLING Me!

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

jabostick — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:55:42 EDT

The difference with the car-motorcycle analogy is that it takes a lot less to suffer a serious injury on a bike, even more so if you don't have a helmet and considering the stakes, it's a stupid thing to do.

But I get your point. And I'm not defending Winslow, just reasoning that, in this instance, Ben's just as big of an asshat (as per FredGarvin's original comment)

jabostick

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

new_commentator — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:52:27 EDT

"Wayne Brady makes Bryant Gumbel look like Malcom X."

So wait, are Dave Chapelle and Paul Mooney racist? Or is it ok when they say it? Because treating one race of people different than another is, in itself, racist.

new_commentator

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Balls State Explorer — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:45:52 EDT

@Yostal: The problem is we don't have the big conversations until some large issue crops up (Limbaugh/McNabb, as an example), and everyone then resorts to screaming at each other. It should be an ongoing dialogue. Every day.

Balls State Explorer

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

broad street bully — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:45:12 EDT

Don't let the liberal media tell you how to think and feel. If you have hate in your heart, let it out.
/Clayton Bigsby

broad street bully

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Sarcastro — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:44:48 EDT

@EditorOfTheDailyFaberian: The funny thing is, two of them have PhDs and the other is a novelist. Me? A crappy bachelor's in English and something barely approximating a job. I make a pretty lame white guy.

Sarcastro

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Red Sox Monster — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:44:34 EDT

I think the comments above from Mr. Cheese Doodle/Sock Puppet himself -- a legend in many people's minds on this site -- are telling. And you know what? A little bit of introspection isn't a bad thing.

Thanks, Will, for posting this. No jokes, no wisecracks. Just thanks.

/Now back to regularly scheduled programming

Red Sox Monster

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

supermike5alive — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:41:51 EDT

@jabostick: well again, Ben was riding legally down the street (stupidly without his helmet) and a woman cut him off, causing the accident which she was to blame. it's the same as if he had been riding in a car legally down the street and had been hit by the woman - maybe not wearing his seatbelt as the helmet metaphor? only if not wearing your seatbelt is legal in Penn.

Winslow, on the other hand, was illegally AND stupidly popping wheelies in a parking lot. he caused his own accident, no one was to blame but himself. i believe he was cited with some kind of crime.

supermike5alive

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

jabostick — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:37:15 EDT

@supermike5alive:
I said stupid not illegal.

jabostick

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

EditorOfTheDailyFaberian — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:33:02 EDT

@Sarcastro: And now, your lawn looks fantastic

EditorOfTheDailyFaberian

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

EditorOfTheDailyFaberian — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:32:37 EDT

@SonofSpurrier: If I wasn't at work...

EditorOfTheDailyFaberian

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

SonofSpurrier — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:31:01 EDT

121 posts and there hasn't been the n-word yet? For shame deadspin posters, for shame.

SonofSpurrier

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Magnakai Haaskivi — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:30:40 EDT

@That-Dude: Fair enough. Aside from my linking the two events after the fact, though, I'd still say that Winslow's coverage took the tone it took because of the image that Winslow himself had created, everything from the "I'm a soldier!" rant to Butch Davis trading up for him to his extended contract hold-out and subsequent leg break. Clevelanders had anticipated seeing something great on the field and they didn't get it. Then, the next season comes along, and they still didn't get it because of the accident. The allure of a potential talent with some character issues against the backdrop of another bad season created a perfect opportunity to cover Winslow poorly; I'm not sure that race had anything to do with the initial coverage.

Magnakai Haaskivi

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

name_goes_here — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:28:17 EDT

"Bomani implored us: "You have to say something about this, because they won't listen to it from me." And he's right."

I'm not really sure what you are saying here, though. That people on the internet are racists? Sure.

I know you've had a few TAN posts here and there, but maybe the best way to say something about this is to hire a few more non-white/non-male writers to contribute to the site regularly.

name_goes_here

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

supermike5alive — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:24:38 EDT

@jabostick: the woman who cut Roethlisberger off was found to be at fault in that accident. riding without a helmet is no illegal.

this would be the same as getting on Ben if he was rear-ending in a car while driving in traffic.

supermike5alive

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

MyronCopacetic — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:22:28 EDT

No disrespect intended, but is Deadspin really the place where any of these lingering questions are going to be answered?

MyronCopacetic

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Yostal — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:21:22 EDT

@Joe Hass: +1. Well said, and glad to see someone else shares my fear and loathing of the Detroit Free Press article comment feature.

Yostal

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

ArmansCopyOfSwank — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:18:00 EDT

@redsoxchick: 100 years of research on the human psyche would like to have a word with you.

ArmansCopyOfSwank

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Nacho Friendly — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:15:57 EDT

I anxiously await Robert Downey Jr's "Tropic Thunder"'s character's opinion on the matter.

Nacho Friendly

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Fat-Fat — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:13:35 EDT

I had a black girlfriend in senior year in high school and articulated my member well.

Fat-Fat

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

jabostick — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:12:43 EDT

@FredGarvin:

You might make the argument that doing wheelies in an empty parking lot is less stupid than riding in traffic without a helmet.

You might also say that assuming Big Ben never popped wheelies and never generally endangered while Winslow always did the opposite himself sort of makes the article's point...

jabostick

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Joe Hass — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:10:54 EDT

Let me add to this (which kinda ties back into the Buzz issue) a though I've been rattling around my head since the Buzz incident last week. It revolves around this analogy:

The Daily Show/Colbert Report:News :: Deadspin:Sports

The idea is that people who involve themselves in the latter can't quite figure out what to do with the former. Meanwhile, the former shrugs and says "We're not in the latter," when more and more it sure looks like they are.

When I hear Leitch talking about the fact that it's just a site for dick jokes and drunk athletes, I can hear at the same time Jon Stewart waving off comments about his interviews with politicians as being just a humor show. And I know what they're both saying, and I'd take either of their sides in a heartbeat. But I can't ignore or dismiss the opposing viewpoint completely. Yeah: you eventually grow up and start playing with the big boys, and whether you like it or not, the rules of the game change.

I struggle with the idea of race. I work in an environment that is 98% white, in the most segregated large city in America. My company decided to have a two-hour lecture on multiculturalism, but held it in a suburban college extension office, instead of either of the large colleges within the city itself that would require these people to, you know, drive on a road other than a freeway in the city. I often say "it's impossible to look at things through someone else's prism," and this is a great example. I'd like to think I've been raised well enough to look past a lot of the biases that other people have, but hell if I know that for sure.

Jones and Leitch are both right when they talk about the rash of bigoted language in the comments of blogs. I'll raise you the fact that The Detroit Free Press's Web site allows comments on every article, and they're all painful to read, as the posters go from one extreme to another, so it's clearly not just "the blogs" who have this problem. I know of people who take advantage of the pseudonyms of the Web to do vile, shameful things. I have a white male relative I love dearly who told me in the past year that the most harmed group in America in the past 40 years was white males, and while I knew he was capable of saying it, it still pained me to hear it.

There's introspection to be done, and more work than multiple generations can accomplish. But the first steps are posts like this one.

Joe Hass

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Proverbial — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:06:54 EDT

@bravo: Let's see how you'd feel after being verbally raped on television.

I'm just glad Will finally got out of the fetal position.

Proverbial

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

supermike5alive — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:04:34 EDT

@Carmen McFanzone: "If Obama was a white man, he would not be in this position. And if he was a woman of any color, he would not be in this position. He happens to be very lucky to be who he is. And the country is caught up in the concept."

supermike5alive

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Sir Hotbod Handsomeface — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:03:53 EDT

@Forced Entry: and a very non-racist +1 to you

Sir Hotbod Handsomeface

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Chamomiles Davis — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:03:50 EDT

We were talking to Bomani Jones, who's very good at this writing business, the other day...

Translation: "Some of my best colleagues are African-American!"

/facetiousness
//royal "We" = inexplicably hilarious

Chamomiles Davis

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Carmen McFanzone — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:02:09 EDT

@supermike5alive:

She's not a guy (insert punchline) but I think the way Geraldine Ferraro was pilloried as a racist etc. when she dared to voice an opinion regarding Obama's treatment by the media and his race might be one example.

/not a political statement of any kind
//no candidate approved this message

Carmen McFanzone

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

bravo — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:01:50 EDT

jeez, lighten up, leitch. ever since bissinger-gate, you seem to be making too much of an effort to be a non-dick-joke-making, bissinger-friendly, blogger just to prove bissinger wrong.

bravo

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Forced Entry — Mon, 05 May 2008 15:00:56 EDT

@Roy Hobbs: I don't think they appreciate being called "Browns", sir

Forced Entry

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Sarcastro — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:56:07 EDT

@Sarcastro: ... therefore I think Roethlisberger's accident is equally humorous as Winslow's.

Or something.

Sarcastro

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Sarcastro — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:54:40 EDT

I spent all weekend hanging out with Latin Americans.

Sarcastro

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

supermike5alive — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:53:48 EDT

@Reasonable Doubt for a Reasonable Price: "Some white guy comes out against Obama and he's automatically a racist"

depends on what you mean by comes out against (maybe) but, can you name one?

supermike5alive

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Reasonable Doubt for a Reasonable Price — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:50:08 EDT

The problem we're going to run into, if indeed this conversation ever takes place, is that no white journalist is going to want to be anywhere near this panel. Why? Because it's a minefield.

The first time he says "No, you're wrong", he's going to be portrayed as a racist. It happens all the time. Hell, it even happens with the primaries. Some white guy comes out against Obama and he's automatically a racist (bear in mind, I'm a big Obama supporter and I believe in his politics). Until we're all grown up enough to put aside the name calling, this is a dead issue.

Reasonable Doubt for a Reasonable Price

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

The Stephen A. Smith Heckling Society of Gentlemen — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:48:45 EDT

Thanks, Will, for a very thoughtful post. It is one that, I guess, hits somewhat close to home for me.

I've done the Stephen A. Smith heckling videos on Youtube for a couple years now. I'm thrilled by how they've caught on and the joy some heckling, a sock and a bag of cheese doodles can bring the world, but I'm periodically dismayed by two things. I'm dismayed that a number of the (presumably white) people who sign the comments are laughing for the wrong reason, the same sort of enjoyment that prompted a mortified Dave Chappelle to cancel the best sketch comedy show of our generation. And I'm saddened by the comments from (presumably black) viewers who assume that the videos are the project of a white racist frat boy. That they couldn't be more wrong about who I am only helps so much.

The AWM movement mentioned here is real, growing even as more benign and thoroughly enjoyable Deadspin snark movement is. The areas where they seem to overlap -- Stephen A. Smith humor, Stu Scott -- can be problematic. These are risks that every entertainer takes. One member of the audience laughs because the structure of Curb Your Enthusiasm's comedy is brilliant. The person next to him laughs because he finds the Holocaust inherently hilarious. Should Larry David have to take responsibility for both sets of laughter?

I'll eventually blog about this more elsewhere, but I think that honest efforts to engage issues like this can only help. I also think that there should be ample room to mock the cartoon character that is Stephen A. without having to worry about the deeper racial implications to the point of paralysis. Chappelle's response was to leave. I don't think that's necessary, but I could be persuaded otherwise.

/doodle joke

The Stephen A. Smith Heckling Society of Gentlemen

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

That-Dude — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:48:42 EDT

@Magnakai Haaskivi: Post modernist thought combined with the benefits of hindsight analyis does not make a cogent argument.

It would be best said that coverage on this site occurred at two different points during their respective scenarios, as Will mentioned.

That-Dude

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Bullshooter — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:48:27 EDT

"Because we think most people read the first few paragraphs about Bissinger, and then when they got to the part where Whitlock started writing about race, their eyes glazed over, and Whitlock turned into the voice of the teacher in "Peanuts."

Will, if you worried about being presumptuous and shallow, the best thing to do would be to stop being presumptuous and shallow... Give me a link and chance to read the article before you presume to know how I feel about it. Some of us don't spread our nets quit as wide as you do and come here for the links as much as the witty discussion.

Bullshooter

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

EditorOfTheDailyFaberian — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:42:47 EDT

@DeepFriar: God I hope so.

And if it is no longer cool, it will always be hilarious.

EditorOfTheDailyFaberian

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Yostal — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:41:35 EDT

The thing I take away from this post is the problem that I had all of last week in trying to wrap my head around where Buzz was trying to come from, and it's the same problem writ large in American society: All we have left are the hard problems, because we've solved all the easy ones. The difference is, each generation solves some of the previous generations difficult problems, but in doing so, creates a whole mess of new problems to deal with.

In 1965, LBJ told America that it was not enough to rid the country of de jure segregation, we needed to rid ourselves of de facto segregation. The issue there is that means changing hearts and minds and that takes time and effort and persistence. There's no magic wand that you can wave to make people tolerant, understanding, and thoughtful, but it also doesn't mean you just give up and let someone else do it.

The problem, collectively, is that America needs to have the big conversations with itself, but it kind of hates itself right now.

Yostal

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Christ Sabo — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:40:01 EDT

Black people talking white is funny. White people talking black is funny.
Some black people look down on other blacks who talk white.
Some white people look down on other whites who talk black.
No need to be so self-analytical, Deadspin. America is always going to make jokes on race and how a race should speak. If its from a well-meaning person (like Will), it is, to me, harmless. We know he doesn't mean anything by it, he's just saying stuff that most of joke (only in front of friends, of course).

Christ Sabo

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

the-Bored — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:37:17 EDT

@Reasonable Doubt for a Reasonable Price: I know. They should have had John Rocker on.

the-Bored

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Your GPA — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:36:25 EDT

I listened to the NPR interview and literally had no clue what you were talking about when you responded. Something about your sister and the Cardinals center fielder. It was understandable you didn't have a good answer for the question since you probably haven't thought about defending every joke you make...but I thought about it some for you.

Within sports there's aggressive stereotypes that are thrown about. Manliness is one. And because so many of our favorite athletes are Black, Blackness is another. There are many Black sports figures who stand heroically or obliviously against the standard Black stereotype. So much so that it's remarkable. Dungy and Gumbel are a couple. They break the (pathetic and damnable, yet prevalent) stereotype to the point that everyone notices it. As a satirist one picks up on that notion and makes a joke about it. Dur, those people don't sound like Fiddy!

Your jokes were lazy, but they're satire. It has a legitimate basis in that it's a comment on a noticeable difference between those figures and the predominant stereotype.

Say you did a glossary entry on Johnny Weir (you may have, I haven't seen the book yet). Say it went something like: "One of the most talented American Olympic athletes in a male sport despite not being a man, at all."

It's a joke about Weir not being the stereotypical male athlete. That's what you did with Dungy and Gumbel.

It's satire. Vaguely homophobish/racist satire. But most everything on this site is vaguely horrible.

Anyway, that is all.

Your GPA

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

scumdog0331 — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:36:14 EDT

@DeepFriar: It better be!!!

scumdog0331

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

supermike5alive — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:35:28 EDT

@scumdog0331: you HAD to tell us that? that the most racist people IN THE WORLD are privileged white liberals?

hmmm... example of A.W.M.?

supermike5alive

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

FriendsLikeJimRome — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:34:27 EDT

On the other hand, Bryant Gumbel can say that he's not going to watch or follow the Olympics because they are "too white" and he still has a broadcasting job.

FriendsLikeJimRome

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Get Him A Body Bag, Yeah! — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:34:15 EDT

But then why does Will foster anti-Semitism by allowing Weintraub to write for this site?

Get Him A Body Bag, Yeah!

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

The Fake Gimel Martinez — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:32:58 EDT

@morrisalmondjoy: So, Deadspin is just for entertainment purposes only? Shits, giggles, etc.? (Not being condescending, just asking.)

The Fake Gimel Martinez

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Roy Hobbs — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:32:15 EDT

@Magnakai Haaskivi: Nope. I grew up in Pittsburgh. I just really hate the team from Cleveland.

Roy Hobbs

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

GreatOdensRaven — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:31:37 EDT

Call me crazy here - but is Will debating regret over a lack of discretion?

That would be one of the three legs this site stands for, no? No access on the left, no discretion on the right, and Rick Ankiel's penis right down the pipe.

GreatOdensRaven

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

scumdog0331 — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:30:49 EDT

As a white man (read: oppressor) from Iowa, who served in the Marine Corps, worked in social services on the West Side of Chicago for a couple years, and now goes to a lily white law school in New England, I have to tell you that the most racist people in the world are privileged white liberals.

These are the people that say things like "ooh, he's so articulate," or "I have a friend that happens to be African-American," or "Affirmitave action is necessary to achieve racial diversity on campus" and don't realize the completely racist perspective of those statements. Even worse, they actually thing they are helping.

/beating a dead Barbaro

scumdog0331

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

EddieRebel — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:30:38 EDT

To be fair, there are no black people in my mom's basement.

EddieRebel

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

DeepFriar — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:29:52 EDT

but its still cool to make fun of horses dying, right?
/crickets

DeepFriar

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

NeckBeard2008 — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:28:03 EDT

@formerly Chief Wahoo: " To be fair, Pahlaniuk watched his father murder his mother, which would put me in a bit of a foul mood."

no, his parents divorced when he was young. what happened was his father later started dating a woman who had just put her boyfriend behind bars for sexual abuse. he had sworn to kill her when he got out, and he did just that. just happened that when he came to kill her chuck's father was there and was murdered as well.

chuck helped in getting the death penalty for the killer, which was something he struggled with a whole hell of a lot. stranger than fiction, his nonfiction book of no relation to the shitty will ferrell movie, goes into it in good depth. heartbreaking story really.

NeckBeard2008

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Get Him A Body Bag, Yeah! — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:26:53 EDT

What's a Nubian?

Get Him A Body Bag, Yeah!

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Magnakai Haaskivi — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:24:12 EDT

@morrisalmondjoy: I'm pretty sure only Leitch cares about the Cardinals, though; it might be his bias, but it's not necessarily shared by Big Daddy Balls or Daulerio. Lumping all the editors together as a coterie of Cardinals fanciers is a bit much.

Magnakai Haaskivi

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

supermike5alive — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:24:09 EDT

I agree (like I have many times in the past) with Bomani.

There IS "a growing "angry white man" movement in the culture" that is palpable in many areas - most noticable in politics these days. This seems to have stemmed from the 2000 election and then the invasion of Iraq - the subsequent cleaving of Amurica (around the war, and Dems/Repubs, and the debate about whether we "lost" or "won" the war, and talky news with O'Wrongly and Olbermann, and screaming talk radio and political websites) has to be the most divided the country has been since before 1900. This division has resulted in the rise of a kind of "angry white man" element to politics and culture that USED to be a fringe element, but is now a full-on political faction that campaigns reach out to.

And if you don't think Obama plays further into the division and growth of the A.W.M., then you, too, are o'wrongly.

I am not kidding.

Bomani rules.

supermike5alive

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

BarbarobicsInstructor — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:23:59 EDT

You know what I haven't had in a while?

Big League Chew

BarbarobicsInstructor

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

The Fan’s Attic — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:23:44 EDT

My problem with Whitlock's criticism and Will's self-loathing about his black men "talking white" comment is that although it may be an easy joke, it's an easy joke that is made in reverse about whites all the time by blacks (see e.g. Chris Rock, Dave Chappelle).

Now it may not have the same connotations, but it is still the same style of joke--a joke about stereotypes--that is a frequent topic for comedy.

/2 cents

The Fan’s Attic

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Johnny LaRue — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:23:12 EDT

@formerly Chief Wahoo: But can't we all just agree that Whitlock is fat?

Johnny LaRue

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Lady Andrea — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:22:08 EDT

@morrisalmondjoy: "the editors" sounds so official. I'm pretty sure it's just Will in his boxers in his apartment (especially back then).

Lady Andrea

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Reasonable Doubt for a Reasonable Price — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:20:10 EDT

Not for nothing, but does anyone else see at least a bit of a problem with a panel talking about race relations in sports and media, and the only white guy on-stage is the host?

Isn't that akin to talking about the state of sports blogs on "The Sports Reporters"?

Reasonable Doubt for a Reasonable Price

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Magnakai Haaskivi — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:19:41 EDT

@Roy Hobbs: You're kidding (I think), but that's almost exactly how I, as a Browns fan, always thought about it. You have a punk kid who's never done anything and is known for mouthiness and is playing on a bad team, and a young QB who just set a bunch of records on a pretty good team. You tell me which one gets the positive press, race aside.

I think that Ben's would've been viewed with more criticism if he'd have missed more time, too; Winslow was hampered by injury for two years and never actually able to answer his critics on the football field. Ben came back later that season and all was forgiven; if Charlie Batch took the Steelers to 6-10 that season because Ben couldn't get back to the field, public sentiment towards Ben would be much different.

Magnakai Haaskivi

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

44 in a Row — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:19:31 EDT

Well said, whitey.

44 in a Row

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

The Gentleman Masher — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:19:09 EDT

It's not any perceived whiteness on the part of Bryant Gumbel - it's just the general douchiness, and the "I have my nuts trapped in a vice" manner of delivery...

The Gentleman Masher

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

SA — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:17:52 EDT

And good job with this post Will.

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

EditorOfTheDailyFaberian — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:17:49 EDT

@LeNoceur: Yeah, well that school of thought can blow it out its ass.

EditorOfTheDailyFaberian

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Sir Hotbod Handsomeface — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:16:31 EDT

@Jefferson Short Bus: +1, somewhat related...

Martin Lawrence & LOLCats references : SHH :: Nibbles : Iracane

Sir Hotbod Handsomeface

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

TheStarterWife — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:15:41 EDT

@formerly Chief Wahoo: And Charlize Theron saw her mother kill her father. Wonder what would happen if word got out she had a bad day on set.

TheStarterWife

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

redsoxchick — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:15:35 EDT

"The fact that someone did not consciously think about something does not mean that it is not there."

Well, actually it does. If you wanted to make it about race, you would have. You didn't because you didn't think it was about race, you thought it was about someone acting like a horse's ass.

There's a lot of things folks can say in the negative about Deadspin that I might agree with, but that it treats black athletes differently than white athletes isn't one of them.

redsoxchick

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Brazil Thrill — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:15:01 EDT

Will may be athletically challenged, but he more than makes up for it with his hard work, tenacity, intensity, and high blogging IQ.

Brazil Thrill

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

morrisalmondjoy — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:14:43 EDT

Deadspin shouldn't get into analyzing itself. It just gets annoying. When the Ankiel HGH story came out, the editors having loved Ankiel's defiant comeback into MLB tried to defend that he was a different case than MCGuire or Palmiero. But it was wasted analysis because Deadspin had already broken part of it's cardinal motto, sports with no favor. So whatever, Deadspin isn't perfect and it doesn't have to patronize itself by trying to summarize its nuances on race.

morrisalmondjoy

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

SA — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:14:43 EDT

And maybe Will Leitch can come along and tell us if we're all acting black enough.

Ooh, burn.

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Rory B. Bellows — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:14:40 EDT

W.C. Heinz would have written this better.

-- Bissinger

Rory B. Bellows

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

LeNoceur — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:13:29 EDT

There is a school of thought that all humor comes from fear and insecurity, that it's a mental self-defense mechanism.

LeNoceur

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

7-8 Deville — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:13:19 EDT

@Afino: Chris Rock sure knows how to pick 'em.

7-8 Deville

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

DennyCrane — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:13:15 EDT

@ghostsoftheSCupcountry: He says he reads the site a few times a week; I'm sure he'll read this. Hopefully he'll join the commentati in debate.

DennyCrane

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

HebrewHammer — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:12:34 EDT

@Little Lebowski Urban Achievers: It's either a parting shot on race, or about some obscure Canadian sport or athlete that no one cares about

HebrewHammer

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Afino — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:11:14 EDT

@KevinNoMaas:

They made a movie about him.

Oh wait, that was Osmosis Jones. My bad.

Afino

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

muggsybogues — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:10:45 EDT

Good, great, grand, wonderful.

Now what?

muggsybogues

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

KevinNoMaas — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:10:08 EDT

Who is this Bomani Jones fella? Does he happen to be your exterminator?

KevinNoMaas

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

ghostsoftheSCupcountry — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:09:35 EDT

Seriously, someone should send Whitlock a copy of this post and a commenter invite. I'd honestly like to have him in the weekend daddy rotation and I think he should be given a chance to meet us in all our glory.

//Dick Joke

ghostsoftheSCupcountry

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Balls State Explorer — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:09:24 EDT

I listened to the Scott Simon interview when it originally aired, and the big disconnect was his friendly, folksy voice nailing Will to the wall. I think by saying a well spoken African American is white also implies that someone like Pacman Jones is a real African American. Brian Copeland spoke to this issue in his one man show, and now book, Not a Genuine Black Man.

[www.amazon.com]

The show created a context for some of of my beliefs and I'd encourage all to read it.

Balls State Explorer

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Dany Heatley Speedwagon — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:09:02 EDT

There is no way Will could be racist, he owns a black shirt!

Dany Heatley Speedwagon

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

DennyCrane — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:08:45 EDT

@TheStarterWife: Alan Moore's not angry; he's just fucking insane.

DennyCrane

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Dany Heatley Speedwagon — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:08:17 EDT

There are only two things in the world I can't stand. People who are intolerant of other peoples races and cultures... and the dutch.

Dany Heatley Speedwagon

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

formerly Chief Wahoo — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:08:16 EDT

@TheStarterWife: To be fair, Pahlaniuk watched his father murder his mother, which would put me in a bit of a foul mood.

formerly Chief Wahoo

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Yinka Double Dare — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:08:09 EDT

@Little Lebowski Urban Achievers: He doesn't count, he's Canadian - it's not even a real country, anyway.

Yinka Double Dare

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

kayceebk — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:07:32 EDT

wait a second. . . "Lemme know" was the point of no return for Whitlock? Really?

kayceebk

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Jen P — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:06:10 EDT

Interesting post, Will. Fact is, for many people, race is a big issue in their everday lives, so yes, they are likely to talk about it regularly.

I can't imagine what it's like to be a black person in Utah. Some of my friends have taken a lot of shit that would've had me looking for somewhere else to live.

Jen P

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

UpstateUnderdog — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:05:52 EDT

When was the last time HBO had a new episode of Real Sex? Less Costas, more Real Sex.

UpstateUnderdog

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Silky John-STON! — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:05:50 EDT

Many cultures approximately correspond with race, no one person is monolithic in their belief structure and prejudice is a natural reaction of the brain to the overwhelming complexity of the world if each person is regarded as an individual at all times.

/one sentence version of a college degree in Sociology

Silky John-STON!

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Bob Loblaw — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:05:47 EDT

bigots empowered by anonymity

is that the follow-up to NWA's "Niggaz with attitude"?

Bob Loblaw

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Jews For Purple Jesus — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:05:43 EDT

"Please, cut the fucking shit, okay. Okay? When I go to the money machine tonight, alright, I ain't looking over my back for the media: I'm looking for bloggas!"

Jews For Purple Jesus

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

formerly Chief Wahoo — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:05:39 EDT

Chris Rock has a good take on this in his current show. Essentially it is that people who are better off have no right to make fun of people with less. Meaning that it's not ok for white people to get pick on black people, just as it's not cool for rich folks to mock the poor or the skinny to mock the fat. I'm probably not expressing this very well, but he definitely got me thinking and I hope I can keep what he said in mind.

/dick joke.

formerly Chief Wahoo

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

EddieRebel — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:05:33 EDT

Thanks to the Zapruder family for the screengrab.

EddieRebel

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Little Lebowski Urban Achievers — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:05:26 EDT

Agreed.

I would also say that John Saunders uses his Sports Reporters platform to talk about race probably as much or moreso than Whitlock or Jackson. Usually valid points, but you know it's coming just about every week.

I also know there's going to be an "Eight Belles" post every day this week and I'm more fine with that.

Little Lebowski Urban Achievers

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Lady Andrea — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:05:23 EDT

@UkraineNotWeak: he also hates women.

Will: Beat it, spook. This don't concern you.
Whitlock and posse: Who you callin' 'spook,' peckerwood?

Lady Andrea

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

TheStarterWife — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:05:05 EDT

Angry white men are new? Don't tell...

Dave Mustaine
Eminem
Charles Palahniuk
Alan Moore

... and millions of more on this planet.

(Sorry, first ones that came to mind.)

TheStarterWife

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

SportsCentre — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:04:25 EDT

All the ignorant comments about black people must be written by the Jews.

SportsCentre

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Dany Heatley Speedwagon — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:03:32 EDT

@Dan Daoust: dammit I shoulda known better.

Dany Heatley Speedwagon

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Pittsburgh Sports and Mini Ponies — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:03:19 EDT

@Whitey Fisk: Nope. Just his t-shirt

Pittsburgh Sports and Mini Ponies

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Dany Heatley Speedwagon — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:02:25 EDT

See, a white guy blogs like this...

and a black guy blog like this.

Dany Heatley Speedwagon

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Jefferson Short Bus — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:02:23 EDT

For the record:

Martin Lawrence jokes : Jefferson Short Bus :: Nibbles jokes : Rob Iracane

Jefferson Short Bus

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

ArkansasFred — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:02:06 EDT

Whitlock didn't capitalize Deadspin. I find that blogcist.

ArkansasFred

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Trenton Makes The World Takes — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:02:01 EDT

No one told Will that Whitlock put his name out on the street?

Trenton Makes The World Takes

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

dont-forget-where-you-came-from-cheese mac — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:01:23 EDT

Pornography:Free Speech::the subject of this post:the blogosphere.

dont-forget-where-you-came-from-cheese mac

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

tomford — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:01:07 EDT

This reminds me of that Stuff White People Like entry - Being an Expert on YOUR Culture. Very well put, Will.

I think what's more interesting about something like Whitlock's column is the unsettling feeling that most "rational" white people get reading it, which they immediately dismiss and claim to be a gross generalization. It's easy to think that by distancing ourselves from the problem it will disappear, but that's not only lazy, but also incorrect.

tomford

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

BigJimSlade — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:01:04 EDT

Was this originally an addendum for GStF?

Otherwise, well said. Don't let the man keep you down Will.

BigJimSlade

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Sheepblog — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:00:55 EDT

Easy and hard rule to live by:

"Never assume to know what another person is thinking...the only way to know is to ask and trust they will tell you the truth."

Sheepblog

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Suss-- — Mon, 05 May 2008 14:00:29 EDT

I for one have a vision where people of all races and creeds come together on blogs and forums to discriminate agains the Swiss.

Suss--

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

ghostsoftheSCupcountry — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:59:59 EDT

@FredGarvin: Amen!

And Will, the fact that you have noticed the concerns and have attempted to address them is a big reason why deadspin thrives. I wish tWWL and the Ted NN/SI would take a clue.

ghostsoftheSCupcountry

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Spectacular Sam — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:59:54 EDT

Did anyone else see the poll on that Whitlock article? Jebus.

Spectacular Sam

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

7-8 Deville — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:59:45 EDT

Will, I think you're absolutely on the money. Your column has given me a minute to reflect, and I would like to take a second to apologize for all of the dick jokes I've made. Unconsciously, those dick jokes could have been made at the expense of the Portuguese.

Or Australians.

7-8 Deville

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

UkraineNotWeak — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:59:28 EDT

I happen to know that Will is no racist. Anti-Semite, well that's a whole nother story.

UkraineNotWeak

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Hustler of Culture — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:59:28 EDT

Well, of course not; the fact that you didn't think you were offending anyone is the reason that it's offensive

Absolutely well said. If only people actually understood that...

Hustler of Culture

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

AkAggie — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:59:04 EDT

Winslow was an asshat in at THE U, hence him being treated as an asshat when something happens. Of all the racial double standards taht go on, this was a bad example.

AkAggie

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Its The Beer Talking — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:59:02 EDT

So he's "Bizzinger" now?

Well, fo shizzle my nizzle.

Its The Beer Talking

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Dr. Chim Richolds — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:58:32 EDT

I think the real question here is this... what kind of camera trick did they use to get Martin Lawrence to appear on that stage three times?

Dr. Chim Richolds

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Thundercracker — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:58:24 EDT

Has Wilbon ever confronted Will about his blog opinions? Just curious based on his constant claims about how he'd do so.

Thundercracker

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

El Gran Guapo — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:58:22 EDT

You could have gotten away with those comments if you wrote about how white sportcasters like Scott Van Pelt try to act black.

El Gran Guapo

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

EddieRebel — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:58:15 EDT

WWBED?

EddieRebel

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Carlton_Whitfield — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:57:53 EDT

It baffles me that Martin Lawrence has yet to weigh in on this topic.

Carlton_Whitfield

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

jake(ymon) — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:57:32 EDT

Well put.

jake(ymon)

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

twoeightnine — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:56:46 EDT

What's the name of this book you wrote?

twoeightnine

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

HebrewHammer — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:56:37 EDT

Racist

HebrewHammer

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Carmen McFanzone — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:56:23 EDT

We didn't land on the blogosphere! THE BLOGOSPHERE LANDED ON US!

Carmen McFanzone

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Hustler of Culture — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:55:32 EDT

There you go plugging your book again, just like Whitlock mentioned.

What? Did I miss something about the column?

Hustler of Culture

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

Dan Daoust — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:54:45 EDT

Black people blog like this and white people blog like this.

/depths of my insight

Dan Daoust

On Race, Message Boards And Shutting The Hell Up

GorgeForeman — Mon, 05 May 2008 13:54:39 EDT

Nicely written and question is one worth considering. Laughing at something like Greg Gumbel's "whiteness" is pretty easy (despite the fact that he is reportedly a nice enough guy and is good at what he does), but it's one of those things that, when you stop and consider what you are saying or laughing along with, it doesn't seem so innocuous, after all.

Whitlock's sofa still hates his guts, though.

GorgeForeman